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Jemmons467

2000 Foreman 450 es no shift

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I am going through the trouble shooting in the manual, I just finished the angle sensor resistance and now onto the shift switch 3P (natural) connector. Do i measure the male or female portion. With the key on the male reads 5.02v and the female reads 0v. 

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The male connector is the harness side so you measure voltage provided by the ECM in the male. The female connector half is the switches side so you check each of the UP/Down switches for continuity (using the Continuity or Ohms scale on the multimeter) on the female connector. 5 volts DC supply is correct, so you're checking it right.

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So I finished troubleshooting per the manual and it is looking like a faulty control unit. Before I go and buy a $300 plus part, when you test the ohms on the angle sensor and it say smooth resistance, how smooth is smooth? When i do it i try to go slow as possible and get between 4-8 ohm jumps

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28 minutes ago, Jemmons467 said:

Before I go and buy a $300 plus part, when you test the ohms on the angle sensor and it say smooth resistance, how smooth is smooth? When i do it i try to go slow as possible and get between 4-8 ohm jumps

 

That china angle sensor is not working, it's garbage and was garbage when ya bought it, same as every china knockoff is known garbage. You do not need a new ECU, just need to clean & dielectric grease the ECU connectors and put new OEM Honda replacement parts back on it.

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17 minutes ago, retro said:

 

That china angle sensor is not working, it's garbage and was garbage when ya bought it, same as every china knockoff is known garbage. You do not need a new ECU, just need to clean & dielectric grease the ECU connectors and put new OEM Honda replacement parts back on it.

I have the OE angle sensor in it right now and that one tested around 2-5 jump. I was trying as slow as possible while holding the multimeter in place. I can re clean and grease it again to see if that works.

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1 minute ago, Jemmons467 said:

I have the OE angle sensor in it right now and that one tested around 2-5 jump.

 

That one is bad too. The resistance curves should rise and fall smoothly (linearly)  on either side of the center sensor position. A new OEM sensor is needed.

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3 minutes ago, retro said:

 

That one is bad too. The resistance curves should rise and fall smoothly (linearly)  on either side of the center sensor position. A new OEM sensor is needed.

Ok, I'll order one. Quick question, when I perform the last test testing the control motor, when I connect the leads to the battery and it changes gear, should it show the gear its in or be blank. It shows N and 1st but blank 2nd and up.

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The transmission is a constant mesh design so it's parts must be rotating in order for the shifting mechanism to complete each shift change. So if the ATV motor is not running, and the ATV is sitting still when it is shifted, some of the shifts will not complete (dogs on the gears cannot engage unless there is motion) and the display will show "--" for each of those incomplete shifts. So what you are experiencing is normal behavior.

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Ok, I was just making sure. I'll order a new angle sensor and try it out. It would be great if thats the issue, it'll save me a few hundred dollars. 

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We learn from you and we appreciate you sharing your diagnosis with us... so let us know how it goes. And have fun!

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53 minutes ago, retro said:

We learn from you and we appreciate you sharing your diagnosis with us... so let us know how it goes. And have fun!

Always fun with a love hate relationship. I appreciate everyone's input and I will let you know how it goes, part will be in Saturday.

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You are learning the ES system , before it is all over you'll be an expert and helping others 

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The new OE angle sensor did not solve the shifting issue. Everything else checked out except the last step which is the ECM. 

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9 minutes ago, Jemmons467 said:

The new OE angle sensor did not solve the shifting issue. Everything else checked out except the last step which is the ECM. 

I see a shift control fora 200 450ES is worth a little  over $300 ...  What would you think a good price to buy and try a used one ? 

Looks like they are  the same from 98-2000 --- I have one on a frame in the yard 

 

CONTROL UNIT, CHANGE
38910-HN0-A11 

 In Stock  $307.92

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43 minutes ago, Fishfiles said:

I see a shift control fora 200 450ES is worth a little  over $300 ...  What would you think a good price to buy and try a used one ? 

Looks like they are  the same from 98-2000 --- I have one on a frame in the yard 

 

CONTROL UNIT, CHANGE
38910-HN0-A11 

 In Stock  $307.92

I honestly do not know, I am waiting on a couple atv yards to get back to me on prices. I'm to new to these machines to price things out. 

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35 minutes ago, Jemmons467 said:

I honestly do not know, I am waiting on a couple atv yards to get back to me on prices. I'm to new to these machines to price things out. 

 

I am a hoarder not a parts guy myself , I don't ride an ES but I got some ES parts ----- I know used parts , people usually ask 1/2 or less of what a new part is worth  ,  Partzilla wants $309 , how's $100 and shipping sound , that's if you are in the USA and have Pay Pal ? 

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2 hours ago, Jemmons467 said:

The new OE angle sensor did not solve the shifting issue. Everything else checked out except the last step which is the ECM.

 

Which test is the ECM failing? Have you opened the ECM connector and dielectric greased it?

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I do not believe that your ECM is bad because your no-shift issue is showing itself intermittently.

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4 minutes ago, retro said:

 

Which test is the ECM failing? Have you opened the ECM connector and dielectric greased it?

I have greased the connectors. I did every step in the manual and got to the last one where you test the control motor. If it doesn't move the motor is bad if the motor does move it say is the control unit.

2 minutes ago, retro said:

I do not believe that your ECM is bad because your no-shift issue is showing itself intermittently.

It had been intermittent but now it won't change at all, even with disconnecting the battery. See I though it was the ecm because of the intermittentness. I dont know at this point. I am pretty mechanically inclined so I feel I did the tests correct.

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Just the motor itself.... if the motor is operating in both directions AND it's not drawing excessive current, then it's good.... and the ECM is bad.

 

I have a used ECM that I can mail ya if ya wanna prove the diagnosis before buying a new ECM....? I need it back though, it belongs on a bike that I'm working on.

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8 minutes ago, retro said:

Just the motor itself.... if the motor is operating in both directions AND it's not drawing excessive current, then it's good.... and the ECM is bad.

 

I have a used ECM that I can mail ya if ya wanna prove the diagnosis before buying a new ECM....? I need it back though, it belongs on a bike that I'm working on.

When I tested it with the battery it would shift gears. I wouldn't want to put you out, plus I'd hate for it to get lost in the mail. Fish said he'd sell me one plus I have another guy that is getting back to me tomorrow. Thank you though. 

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You're welcome, hollar if I can help ya!

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I have been thinking about this (thats dangerous, I know... ☺️)  and wondering to myself if the shift motor may be drawing excessive current? If so, that could explain why the power transistor inside the ECM has failed. Or has it? Have you checked the shift motor fuse to see if it blew while you been working on this?

 

Do you have an amp meter handy that can handle up to 20 amps that you can use to measure the current required for each shift while using the battery for power?

 

My concern is that the shift motor may fry the next ECM that ya plug in unless you can prove that it won't. 🙂

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