Jemmons467 179 Posted January 27, 2021 Thank you guys I appreciate it. Like I said before it is confusing why mine is wired one way and the manual shows another. This would be a great time for a parts wheeler but hard to find one by me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted January 27, 2021 1 hour ago, Jemmons467 said: Thank you guys I appreciate it. Like I said before it is confusing why mine is wired one way and the manual shows another. This would be a great time for a parts wheeler but hard to find one by me. One thing on your wiring that don't make sense to me , you have that second fuse box with two 30amp fuses in it , my manual's wire diagram shows only one 30 amp fuse in that box , but the partzilla part diagram shows two 30 amp fuses in one box 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted January 27, 2021 This wiring harness issue is getting crazy ----- I have a TRX450ES frame in the yard , it has the wiring harness still on it , I went out and looked this morning and snapped a pic , I couldn't see the vin number too well as it is overcast and still darkish so the year is unknown at this time , but I know it is 1st gen 1998-2001 as the cover on the fuse box is different on those years , 2nd gen has a much heavier duty box and water tite cover on them and snaps on the sides to lock it down , so I can't even find a second fuse box , either with one or two fuses in it on this 450ES , but there is the single fuse holder with a 30 in it , with small gauge same color wire going in and out ---it is pic'ed below When you look up the years of the 98-2001 450s with ES , they only show 2 different wiring harnesses , 98 list two part numbers that work , first part number shows to only fit a 98 , second part number fits 98-2001 , see how there were 2 different #8s https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/atv/1998/trx450es-a-fourtrax-forman-es/wire-harness then I see one year there was a 450 ES AM https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/atv/1998/trx450es-am-fourtrax-forman-es/wire-harness, which brings up the difference of that AM compared to others , it shows a wiring harness breakdown and they only part listed ( to be different ) in it is one 30Amp fuse , the pic they show is the same pic as other models , so that is kind of crazy All that craziness makes me wonder , what year do you really have or is that atv produced for Canada and was brought into the USA , since you are so close to the border , since I believe your in Maine , I do believe the vin # can tell you not only the year but also what country it was manufactured for 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
_Wilson_™ 6,557 Posted January 27, 2021 Canada model is what i was thinking too.... we ran into kind of the same with @freebo86 04 450es ... on the brake light harness. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bcsman 1,380 Posted January 27, 2021 I'm not sure what a 450ES AM is quite honestly....made for another country?? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted January 27, 2021 15 minutes ago, bcsman said: I'm not sure what a 450ES AM is quite honestly....made for another country?? Sometimes there is some option or safety feature that only is required in one State , example : brake light for Maine , so there will be a M after the model number , then if you click on the TRX450ES AM it won't show you every part breakdown for that model , just the pages that there were differences for , you would use the regular TRX450 part breakdown for all your other needs 1998 TRX450ES A https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/atv/1998/trx450es-a-fourtrax-forman-es 1998 TRX450ES AM https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/atv/1998/trx450s-am-fourtrax-forman-s Now with that all being said ^^^ above , " sometimes " ( not all atvs have this sticker ) you might see a decal /label on the frame , on the front tube behind bumper or under the seat and it would say TRX450ES Y , in this case the Y is the 10th digit of the vin # and designated the year 2000 = TRX450ES 2000 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted January 27, 2021 I went back out in daylight and took another pic , found a W on the vin so this is a 98 ES , look close there are two single fuse holders with 30 amp fuses one has red wires and the other has orange I looked thru harnesses , found 2 foot shift 450s , didn't see another 450 ES then the one on the frame in the pic --- my shed is a disaster , counted 13 engines that were visible 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bcsman 1,380 Posted January 27, 2021 Fish that second 30 amp inline fuse with the red wires should be labelled MAIN FUSE on the diagram and ties to ignition and rectifier..... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bcsman 1,380 Posted January 27, 2021 Jemmons, my wire bundles in the fuse box area are all covered with black tape and hate to start tearing it all off to see where the wires are going... But I believe the orange wire runs directly to a round connector by the shift motor. So in your case if yours started shifting after removing that fuse, that makes no sense and must be tied to something different. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jemmons467 179 Posted January 27, 2021 Thank you everyone for your help. I am not sure where the vin is on the wheeler but these are the stickers I could find. I also have the bill of sale from when the guy I bought it from bought it from the original owner. So I have 3 30 amp fuses one on the orange inline like others have shown and 2 in the same holder with red wires coming out of it. I see the 3 30amp when looking at the wiring harness on partzilla but not in the service manual. And what also gets me is that when I pulled the inline 30amp out of the holder and put it back in, it started shifting again. And mind you that goes from the red white wire in the relay to a red wire to the starter solenoid. So I am a bit lost. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted January 27, 2021 According to that vin number , the decoder I ran it thru says it is made in the USA and it is a TRX450S not aTRX450 ES ----how do you shift gears , with your foot or thumb ?? 2000 Honda TRX450S VIN478TE2204Y4109534 The VIN decodes to a 2000 Honda TRX450S with a 450CC engine. Click Here for a VEHICLE HISTORY REPORT on this Vehicle Basic Model Year 2000 Make Honda Series TRX450S Origin UNITED STATES Trim Level - Drivetrain Engine Type 450CC 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted January 27, 2021 I can see it says ES on the decals , that is so weird , I know another vin checker , going to try that one and see how it comes back 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted January 28, 2021 It comes back as a FM on this decoder , FM and S are both foot shifter , they started calling them FMs in 2002 , they were called S up to 2001 , it gets weirder , EH SPECIFICATIONS MAKE HONDA MANUFACTURER NAME HONDA MFG., INDIANA., LLC. MODEL TRX450FM (FourTrax Foreman) MODEL YEAR 2000 PLANT CITY TIMMONSVILLE VEHICLE TYPE MOTORCYCLE PLANT COUNTRY UNITED STATES (USA) PLANT STATE SOUTH CAROLINA MANUFACTURER ID 993 BODY CLASS Off-road Vehicle - All Terrain Vehicle (ATV) (Motorcycle-style) GROSS VEHICLE WEIGHT RATING Class 1A: 3,000 lb or less (1,360 kg or less) TRANSMISSION STYLE Motorcycle - Shaft Drive ENGINE NUMBER OF CYLINDERS 1 DISPLACEMENT ( C C) 433 DISPLACEMENT ( C I) 26.423281193 DISPLACEMENT ( L) 0.433000 ENGINE STROKE CYCLES 4 FUEL TYPE - PRIMARY Gasoline NOTE NOTE Shaft 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
_Wilson_™ 6,557 Posted January 28, 2021 On January 8, 2021 at 2:54 PM, Jemmons467 said: So I had to use the emergency shift to get back, which it will shift all the way to 5th using that. So I am at a loss right now. I might put the old angle sensor back in to see if that might be it but I check the continuity of the new one and its fine. yeah.... something odd some place. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bcsman 1,380 Posted January 28, 2021 Here's a good pic for my VIN location. Should be the same on yours jemmons. It is stamped so maybe not easy to see if the frame is dirty. It's near the top... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
retro 4,041 Posted January 28, 2021 Sorry it took me all day to get here... I dug out a 2000 450 ES harness and my harness matches Fishfiles' harness. I only have one 30a Main fuse inside the small weatherproof box with two red wires to that main fuse. I have the inline 30a shift motor fuse as well. One orange wire from the inline fuse has continuity with the harness positive on the solenoid, same as yours. The other orange wire from the inline fuse has continuity with the Red/White wire going into the Engine relay. I have my harness handy now so I can help ya with tracing wires or help with any questions ya got.... my multimeter should be able to answer them. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jemmons467 179 Posted January 28, 2021 So my winch and mounting plate are in the way and it'll take me to long to pull it out tonight. I'll try tomorrow. Thanks again. So the VIN coming back as an S and not ES is very confusing. Not even sure what that means or how it could happen Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bcsman 1,380 Posted January 28, 2021 12 hours ago, Jemmons467 said: So my winch and mounting plate are in the way and it'll take me to long to pull it out tonight. I'll try tomorrow. Thanks again. So the VIN coming back as an S and not ES is very confusing. Not even sure what that means or how it could happen Yes you really need to read the actual VIN on your frame to make things easier to troubleshot.....now you know where it's located hope you can get to it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
retro 4,041 Posted January 28, 2021 Don't fret over the service manual being incorrect... that manual is chock full of errors, as most of the others are too! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
_Wilson_™ 6,557 Posted January 28, 2021 just to clear this up, SOME ... which switch does yours have ? 1st, << (ES) or 2nd pic ? from what I've read so far ... should be the 1st pic. doesn't look like the service manual will be of much help. the more pics we have the better. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted January 28, 2021 6 hours ago, Jemmons467 said: So my winch and mounting plate are in the way and it'll take me to long to pull it out tonight. I'll try tomorrow. Thanks again. So the VIN coming back as an S and not ES is very confusing. Not even sure what that means or how it could happen I think you have a ES no doubt , you spoke of not shifting , angle sensor and you throwing the shift motor , all things that wouldn't have happen with a S or a FM ----- the thing that concerned me was what year is it and where was the atv manufactured for , as when they are made to Canadian specs sometimes there are differences ----- I think what happened is with the winch in place the previous owner couldn't get the correct vin for the bill of sale , so he used another ---- let's just hope that is all it was Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jemmons467 179 Posted January 28, 2021 @_Wilson_™ I have the first one. @Fishfiles for all appearances it is an ES it has everything for electric shift, I am just concerned about the VIN. It put the current winch and plate on it after I got it. The original owner just used a piece of 1/4" bar stock to secure the winch so he would of had an unobstructed view of the vin. Depending when I get home tonight I'll pull the winch off and double check the vin. I feel the chances are slim that he guessed on the vin and it worked. That or this machine is possibly stolen and a vin was used off a wrecked or parts bike. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted January 28, 2021 Post the serial number off the engine , we might be able to determine if that engine is suppose to be on that year frame A 2000 TR450 ES frame vin number starts at 478TE224*X4100001-up and the engine starts at TE22E-81000001-up Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
_Wilson_™ 6,557 Posted January 28, 2021 thank you, i was sure .... i mentioned above from you earlier post about using the emergency shifter, just covering as many bases as we can to narrow this down. besides the vin... what got me was .. when you pulled that fuse, it started shifting again , but it was also said you pulled the fuse and put it back in, and again it started shifting, you went back with a new oem angle censor, but .the shifting was still part time i see several post about the shift motor ... was it replaced with a oem ?? or a china made ? it might be posted here, and i just over looked or missed it. ... if it is oem, plus a new oem angle sensor ... could be just a small loose wire connection / short, from the what PO did. next question .... does it act any defrent when it's cold, or hot, or when your riding and shift while turning right or left ? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites