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TrxPipUK

1992 350D Starting problems

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@shadetree I ain't got a air impact in my workshop/shed unfortunately. 

 

So should the kickstart shaft wobble? 

 

And yeah the mesh was very mucky to say the least lol... You'd probably strip the engine out and rebuild, and that's probably the best thing to do here. But right now I don't have the time for all that. I'd prefer to just get her running for the moment lol... she'll get an engine rebuild one day I promise.

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The rechargeable electric impacts now day are  strong enough to break the clutch nuts loose , I got a Ryobi and use it a lot to not have to listen to the compressor , I've taken the 10 lug nuts off my 4500 Dodge with it and they are usually over tightened by the tire store ----nice tool to have around , you would use it a lot , just for tires it is worth having -------  the Milwaukee and Dewalt might be a little stronger , but so is the price 

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Even the corded electric impacts do a good job, are usually cheaper and handy to have around. The kick starter will have some play when just held in on the one side but not a lot.  The side cover secures it.

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Oh boy... you are in a tough spot Pip. Getting that change clutch nut off is the least of your problems now. Just as I feared your motor needs to be cleaned out before you can reassemble it. It looks to me like the centrifugal clutch weights might be worn out too. We'll have a look at those shortly.... along with the oil pump but lets move on.

 

I am going to provide my opinions now on what you are dealing with and explain how you might take a shortcut that should allow you to reassemble the motor with an expectation that it might run and last for a while. You really should remove the motor and tear it down completely to fix it right... but you have indicated that is not an option for you. So lets get started on plan B, and do our best to win eh?

 

I believe the previous owner(s) have run that motor using the wrong type (and cheapest low quality) motor oil in it for many years and rarely ever changed the oil. Your motor oil has broken down badly and is saturated with carbon. The motor has water in it too. It is basically used up, heavily abused and abandoned junk in my opinion. The sump in that motor is full of hard carbon particles and decayed, broken down motor oil. Its got to be flushed out thoroughly else all of the money and time that you are spending on it will be wasted. So here is my shortcut suggestions...

 

Leave the clutch nut alone for now and begin working to remove the motor from the frame. Remove any loose thrust washers, o-rings and anything else that is loose in there so you won't lose them while handling the motor once it is out of the frame. Once the motor is out remove the oil drain plug and the rags that you have stuffed around the rod and cam chain and begin to wash and flush out the crankcase with diesel fuel, mineral spirits or other solvent, whatever you can get your hands on. You'll need a large drain tray or drain pan to sit the motor in and catch the junk and solvent that you'll use. Do this outdoors, solvents are flammable. Don't catch yourself on fire.

 

Pour a small amount at a time into the crankcase and roll the motor around (roll it upside down too) so the solvent will coat and wash off all of the internal parts, cases and sump. Drain and flush it out several times until there are no more black particles washing out of the sump. Once its clean use compressed air to help force out the remaining solvent as you roll and tilt the motor around in your large drain tray. Then pour some clean motor oil into the sump and roll the motor around to coat the internal parts with clean oil. The small amount of solvent remaining should mix with that oil.... then drain it all out one last time. Stuff clean rags down around the rod and cam chain again before cleaning up your messes.

 

Remove the clutch nut using a 27mm socket and Impact wrench. Either borrow an impact from a friend or take the motor to a shop and ask a mechanic to zip that nut off for you. Then install the motor back into the frame.

 

This is how I would handle things if given no other choice. Be careful man...

 

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18 hours ago, TrxPipUK said:

@shadetree I ain't got a air impact in my workshop/shed unfortunately. 

 

So should the kickstart shaft wobble? 

 

And yeah the mesh was very mucky to say the least lol... You'd probably strip the engine out and rebuild, and that's probably the best thing to do here. But right now I don't have the time for all that. I'd prefer to just get her running for the moment lol... she'll get an engine rebuild one day I promise.

as retro pointed out ^^^, your taking a very big gamble here bro !. you can try the short cut if ya want ?, but to me ?, that engine will not last very long if you do not do this the right way. i hope you decide to do it the right way ?, but if not ?, oh well..you will live and learn what short cuts can do in the long run !.

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It's not voodoo magic splitting cases.  You just have to take your time. 

 

Put a big sheet of wood or cardboard out, and take things apart there, keeping everything arranged as it comes out.

 

 

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Yep, besides a few gaskets it's just time at this point. You don't even need a flywheel puller since that can be left in place. That "junk" will contaminant the oil and ruin a new set of rings.

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Either way that you approach this problem Pip, its gonna require some more work and expense. As you have learned we are each committed to going step-by-step with ya... we enjoy your experiences and successes as much as you do. We will celebrate just as you will too... lets get started on splitting those cases eh?

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Wow thanks for all the input guys. Means a lot that you are all willing to keep putting your advice and knowledge into this to help me out. 

I know its going to be the best idea to split the cases and clean the engine out properly... so that's what I'm going to do. I'm not sure when I'll get round to doing this, it might have to wait till around June or so.  I'm 18 and have exams to prepare for at the moment at college (college is a bit different over here lol) so most of my free time is going into that currently 😞 lol. I might end up doing it over a period of time I'm not sure, the only negative to that is I'd probably start to forget what goes where lol. So doing it when I'm totally free looks to be the best option. 

 

Appreciate all the help

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I think you've made a wise decision Pip. Hollar at us when ya get ready to rip and tear on it.

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2 hours ago, retro said:

I think you've made a wise decision Pip. Hollar at us when ya get ready to rip and tear on it.

Thanks man 🙂 I sure will

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take your time pip..its cool...we only charge by the hour anyway ?!..lol.

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On 3/6/2020 at 1:17 PM, TrxPipUK said:

Wow thanks for all the input guys. Means a lot that you are all willing to keep putting your advice and knowledge into this to help me out. 

I know its going to be the best idea to split the cases and clean the engine out properly... so that's what I'm going to do. I'm not sure when I'll get round to doing this, it might have to wait till around June or so.  I'm 18 and have exams to prepare for at the moment at college (college is a bit different over here lol) so most of my free time is going into that currently 😞 lol. I might end up doing it over a period of time I'm not sure, the only negative to that is I'd probably start to forget what goes where lol. So doing it when I'm totally free looks to be the best option. 

 

Appreciate all the help

Yes, focus on school. If you find yourself wanting a break from studying, assignments, and exams, you may find yourself wanting to jump into this project as a distraction. Do that by planning, and organizing. Sort/clean your shop, catalog and label parts. It will help with assembly.  Don't go any deeper until you are ready to devote some time to it. School and exams are a priority. (I'm a teacher, gotta get the word out). Good luck on your exams, we're rooting for ya!

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5 hours ago, TRX Student said:

Yes, focus on school. If you find yourself wanting a break from studying, assignments, and exams, you may find yourself wanting to jump into this project as a distraction. Do that by planning, and organizing. Sort/clean your shop, catalog and label parts. It will help with assembly.  Don't go any deeper until you are ready to devote some time to it. School and exams are a priority. (I'm a teacher, gotta get the word out). Good luck on your exams, we're rooting for ya!

Thanks man. Appreciate it 🙂

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Good news in some ways I guess lol... Due to this Corona virus my college has been shut down (as everyone is panicking there heads off lol). Meanwhile I basically have nothing to do. Sooo.. I think I might as well get stuck into this engine ey 🙂 I picked up an electric impact driver the other day and just got round to whizzing that nut off. It was sooo easy!! lol

What are the next steps after I get the engine out the frame? 

Hope ya'll are well 

 

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Hi Pip, You will be disassembling and reassembling the cases working from the right side most of the time. I would begin by cleaning the entire exterior of the motor after you get it out of the frame, so dirt and grime stuck to the outside (on the left side) don't end up on the inside during reassembly. You can remove both clutches, the oil pump and oil pipe and the cam chain from the right side before removing the motor from the frame, its easiest to do right now.

 

After the motor is out and has been cleaned up, take off the starter motor and the left side cover and let us know that you are ready to split it. There are several crankcase bolts that must be removed from the left side. You can leave the flywheel on the crank on the left side to save you from buying a flywheel puller. You will be splitting the cases with the left side laying down, right side facing straight up. Lay your parts assemblies out in order on a sheet of cardboard (or whatever ya got that is clean) and take photos as you work that you can refer back to later while assembling.

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5 hours ago, retro said:

Hi Pip, You will be disassembling and reassembling the cases working from the right side most of the time. I would begin by cleaning the entire exterior of the motor after you get it out of the frame, so dirt and grime stuck to the outside (on the left side) don't end up on the inside during reassembly. You can remove both clutches, the oil pump and oil pipe and the cam chain from the right side before removing the motor from the frame, its easiest to do right now.

 

After the motor is out and has been cleaned up, take off the starter motor and the left side cover and let us know that you are ready to split it. There are several crankcase bolts that must be removed from the left side. You can leave the flywheel on the crank on the left side to save you from buying a flywheel puller. You will be splitting the cases with the left side laying down, right side facing straight up. Lay your parts assemblies out in order on a sheet of cardboard (or whatever ya got that is clean) and take photos as you work that you can refer back to later while assembling.

Awesome thanks man. What's the best way to clean up the exterior of the motor? Would you suggest wire brushing or would that be too aggressive? 

 

I'll get the oil pump, pipes and cam chain out tomorrow probably. Then pull the motor from the frame and get it cleaned up. 

 

Here's a pic of where it's at.. also the new impact driver lol 

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On 3/6/2020 at 1:17 PM, TrxPipUK said:

Wow thanks for all the input guys. Means a lot that you are all willing to keep putting your advice and knowledge into this to help me out. 

I know its going to be the best idea to split the cases and clean the engine out properly... so that's what I'm going to do. I'm not sure when I'll get round to doing this, it might have to wait till around June or so.  I'm 18 and have exams to prepare for at the moment at college (college is a bit different over here lol) so most of my free time is going into that currently 😞 lol. I might end up doing it over a period of time I'm not sure, the only negative to that is I'd probably start to forget what goes where lol. So doing it when I'm totally free looks to be the best option. 

 

Appreciate all the help

Dude , proud of you to take the challenge at 18 while doing school , later in life if this rebuild is successful , you will look back and say WOW and if it is not you will say wow!! Go for it , you got back !!! 

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Look at it this way , do it right now and you are building a home , the way you were going would be a short term rental !!! LOL 

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4 hours ago, TrxPipUK said:

What's the best way to clean up the exterior of the motor?

 

That's your decision since we don't know what all tools, solvents, shop equipment etc. that you have on hand or what you expect the motor to look like when you're done. Once ya get all dirt and grime off it should be clean enough to handle while working on it.

 

Cleaning parts up for reassembly is very time consuming, so decide beforehand whether you are building a shiny show-bike or not, and plan accordingly.. Generally 30%-50% of total job hours are required for scraping gaskets, chasing threads with thread taps, cleanup, lubing & prepping of old parts.

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11 hours ago, Fishfiles said:

Dude , proud of you to take the challenge at 18 while doing school , later in life if this rebuild is successful , you will look back and say WOW and if it is not you will say wow!! Go for it , you got back !!! 

Thanks dude!! Yeah hopefully I'll be proud of myself when she's all done up 🙂

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6 hours ago, retro said:

 

That's your decision since we don't know what all tools, solvents, shop equipment etc. that you have on hand or what you expect the motor to look like when you're done. Once ya get all dirt and grime off it should be clean enough to handle while working on it.

 

Cleaning parts up for reassembly is very time consuming, so decide beforehand whether you are building a shiny show-bike or not, and plan accordingly.. Generally 30%-50% of total job hours are required for scraping gaskets, chasing threads with thread taps, cleanup, lubing & prepping of old parts.

Okay thanks. All I've really got in the way of equipment are wire brushes and brake cleaners. Is it okay to use wire brushes on the motor or will it be too harsh?

 

I'd like the exterior to be protected and last a long time. So that would probably mean painting it. I know shade uses a dremel tool on his motors to get them super clean and ready for paint, but surely I can do something by hand. It'll just take longer by hand lol

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this is the correct thread, MAKE SURE TO USE AN OEM FUEL PUMP !.

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So the engine is out and cleaned up best I can get it at the moment. I have got all the loose dirt off so alls left is dirt that has just set hard on the motor. I presume it'll be fine to leave that on there as it won't fall into the motor.

 

Next step is taking off the left side

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Opened up the left side cover and it's not looking too healthy in there... Should I be worried about the rust on the flywheel? 

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