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Belizeted

Honda Foreman 08 runs fine for a while then quits. Starts fine later.

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17 hours ago, Belizeted said:

On top of the expense of OEM parts, we have to add international shipping, plus punitive customs duty. 

 

I thought that might be the case given your username.  ATV parts are definitely cheap in the US compared to other places.

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Yes and no Home Depot either!  

 

Anyway, I used a grease needle on my grease gun to try to shoot some grease into the front bearing and reassembled everything and took the ATV for two test rides today. 

 

On the first run, it went for about 10 minutes then started its characteristic missing before quitting altogether.  I opened the gas cap and it ran a little ways then suddenly stalled.  I shut off the ignition and waited for a few minutes.  The fan was not running. Then I  restarted and returned back home without incident. The fan was now running upon my return.  I have a loud muffler so I can't hear the fan when driving.  Therefore, I thought it was a venting issue with the gas cap.  

 

About an hour later I did another run and this time I frequently cracked open the gas cap.  I ran to my destination with no issues at all.  Fan not running when I arrived.  I waited about 1/2 hour to return and on the way the engine started missing, so before it stalled completely, I stopped and shutdown the engine (the fan was not running).  After a few minutes, I restarted and went a short ways and then again it started missing. I stopped and turned it off.  No fan.  After a few minutes, I restarted and then continued a good long distance with no missing.  When I returned home, the fan was now running.

 

It seems like either the fan is intermittent or that it is being told to turn on too late.  Do you know if there is something with the system that causes the engine to shutdown when it starts getting too hot?

 

By the way, never have it seen the oil temp light come on except for when I power up with the key, and then it goes off as it should. 

 

I want to order another fan which is going to take several weeks at least to arrive, but can you tell me how you wire a toggle switch to override the system and turn the fan on.  I'm thinking to splice in a wire to the hot wire of the fan, run it to the switch and on the other side to the 12V battery.

 

 

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I have had several of the  05–11 foot shift 500s. I have never have one overheat

 

sounds to me more like you have a fuel starvation issue, possibly from a partially clogged fuel petcock.

 

Put a little gas in a squirt bottle or get a can of starter fluid, and next time you take it out and it dies,  put a shot of gas or starter fluid up in the intake and see if it will start back up

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1 hour ago, Belizeted said:

 

can you tell me how you wire a toggle switch to override the system and turn the fan on.  I'm thinking to splice in a wire to the hot wire of the fan, run it to the switch and on the other side to the 12V battery.

 

 

 

Yep , that is what I did ------  but , I am not using the OEM fan controllers on the 450s and the 300s never had OEM fans on them to start with 

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Thanks.  I'm not sure where I would spray the starter fluid.  In the air filter box or the plastic "thing" under the seat???  Should I pull the gas tank and throughly clean it and the gas valve? 

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2 hours ago, Belizeted said:

Thanks.  I'm not sure where I would spray the starter fluid.  In the air filter box or the plastic "thing" under the seat???  Should I pull the gas tank and throughly clean it and the gas valve? 

Lets see if it helps first. 
 

pull air box lid, air filter, than shoot a very short shot of starter fluid into the intake where you removed the air filter

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Thanks very much.  I got it now.  When I get a chance I am going to pull the gas tank and try to clean it.  I remember a few years ago I tried to remove the petcock but the mounting screws would just spin and never did get it out.  Any suggestions on how to remove this without damaging the tank?

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2 hours ago, Belizeted said:

Thanks very much.  I got it now.  When I get a chance I am going to pull the gas tank and try to clean it.  I remember a few years ago I tried to remove the petcock but the mounting screws would just spin and never did get it out.  Any suggestions on how to remove this without damaging the tank?

I don't know of any procedure to remove the screws in a plastic tank. I gave you a diagnostic procedure early in this thread.. You may have missed it somehow. Read it please. It should help so you don't have to guess what the problem is.

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On 7/23/2022 at 6:32 AM, Belizeted said:

Thanks very much.  I got it now.  When I get a chance I am going to pull the gas tank and try to clean it.  I remember a few years ago I tried to remove the petcock but the mounting screws would just spin and never did get it out.  Any suggestions on how to remove this without damaging the tank?

 

Oooh, that's not good.  Once those nutserts start to spin in the plastic they can be a real pain in the rear.


I use an impact now to pull those 8mm bolts on any Honda plastic tanks.  The impact will shock the bolts loose before they start to spin those nutserts. 

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Thanks for the tip on the impact wrench.  I'll try it out.  Another thing I discovered is that I have been running my tank on the RES valve setting. When I try it next time I'll have it moved to ON.  I thought perhaps there might be sediment in the bottom of the tank causing a partial blockage.  I'll try to take it for  a spin today.

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I'm sure you guys are getting tired of hearing from me but I highly value your advise nevertheless...

 

This morning I took the ATV for a ride to my "cabin" about 15 minutes away.  I had the fuel valve to ON.  All ran smoothly for about half the distance when I started getting an occasional backfire and then the engine started missing.  I stopped, turn it off, waited a few minutes and it started right up.  It ran another distance with a repeat of the same thing.  I reached my place and turned it off and checked the fan - not running.  After about a 1/2 hour or so, I made the return trip. Got partway back - same thing - several times.  On the last startup everything ran very smoothly for the much longer distance home.  When I reached, I found the fan was running now.  I concluded at the time that it was a fan/cooling related issue.  However, after turning it off for around 5 minutes, I went to start it and it cranked okay but would not fire.  This is the first time for that since my original episode.  Taking the advice of Mister Clean and Jeepwm69, I sprayed starter fluid into the intake and it started right up.  

 

It seems like the carb and fuel tank and lines might need a cleaning.  Any thoughts?

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7 minutes ago, Belizeted said:

I'm sure you guys are getting tired of hearing from me but I highly value your advise nevertheless...

 

This morning I took the ATV for a ride to my "cabin" about 15 minutes away.  I had the fuel valve to ON.  All ran smoothly for about half the distance when I started getting an occasional backfire and then the engine started missing.  I stopped, turn it off, waited a few minutes and it started right up.  It ran another distance with a repeat of the same thing.  I reached my place and turned it off and checked the fan - not running.  After about a 1/2 hour or so, I made the return trip. Got partway back - same thing - several times.  On the last startup everything ran very smoothly for the much longer distance home.  When I reached, I found the fan was running now.  I concluded at the time that it was a fan/cooling related issue.  However, after turning it off for around 5 minutes, I went to start it and it cranked okay but would not fire.  This is the first time for that since my original episode.  Taking the advice of Mister Clean and Jeepwm69, I sprayed starter fluid into the intake and it started right up.  

 

It seems like the carb and fuel tank and lines might need a cleaning.  Any thoughts?

I doubt it is a carburetor problem because it runs good for a few minutes which indicates a clean carb. It is most likely a fuel flow problem. It almost keeps up with demand but not quite enough. A quick method to check fuel is to disconnect the hose from the carburetor and let it drain into a container. Allow it to drain for about one minute. You may notice it drain good at first and then slow down to a dribble.I am not sure if this machine has a fuel pump. The fuel should flow thru the pump if the end of the the hose is well below the fuel level in the tank. If that is the problem then you will have to remove the petcock and clean or replace it at a minimum. If you can break the filter off the petcock somehow and recover fuel flow you can add an external fuel filter in line as a substitute. I would suggest cleaning the carburetor at the same time for surety.

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29 minutes ago, Misterclean said:

I doubt it is a carburetor problem because it runs good for a few minutes which indicates a clean carb. It is most likely a fuel flow problem. It almost keeps up with demand but not quite enough. A quick method to check fuel is to disconnect the hose from the carburetor and let it drain into a container. Allow it to drain for about one minute. You may notice it drain good at first and then slow down to a dribble.I am not sure if this machine has a fuel pump. The fuel should flow thru the pump if the end of the the hose is well below the fuel level in the tank. If that is the problem then you will have to remove the petcock and clean or replace it at a minimum. If you can break the filter off the petcock somehow and recover fuel flow you can add an external fuel filter in line as a substitute. I would suggest cleaning the carburetor at the same time for surety.

 

Yep, sounds like a partially clogged petcock to me.

 

No fuel pump on an 08, just gravity feed.

 

I'd take the tank off, pull the petcock, and try blowing through it (with it off the tank) and see what kinda crud comes out of it. 

 

 

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Thanks all.  I drained the fuel out of the hose and I didn't particularly notice a difference in flow.  It certainly wasn't gushing our of the hose but it was more than a mere dribble. 

I pulled the gas tank and fuel hose.  The strainer in the hose near the carb looked clean.  Taking off the petcock was a pain. I was right, one of the bolts was spinning and with my small impact wrench I got it out - all of it so I have a mangled plastic hole where the nut was.  I cleaned it up and filled it full of JB Weld and put the nut back in place and will now wait on that to fully cure for a day or two. 

 

I blew on the petcock but didn't see a whole lot of crud.  It was cruddy around the base of the filter and there seemed to be junk inside where the fuel flows.  I blew through it with a compressor and now have the petcock valve soaking in acetone. I'll probably do this for some hours or maybe even overnight while the JB Weld cures.  Then I plan to clean out the inside of the tank and pull the carb and give that a cleaning.  Then its re-assembly and see what happens.  

 

Anything I'm missing? 

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No, but if it was flowing well we might have yet to find the issue.

 

But at least we go through things we can eliminate them as possible causes, even if it's tedious doing so.

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Yes, but if it was just a little bit of clog it might have been enough to cause this problem.   It might be a couple of days before I am able to get everything back together but will let you know the result and thanks again for your generous help!

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17 hours ago, Belizeted said:

Yes, but if it was just a little bit of clog it might have been enough to cause this problem.   It might be a couple of days before I am able to get everything back together but will let you know the result and thanks again for your generous help!

Did you have the fuel cap on when testing fuel flow? sometimes the vent in the cap will restrict enough to cause problems. Also, do you have ethanol? We do. All fuels are viscous enough to have a "dragging" effect on fuel flow. Ethanol drags more than 100% gasoline. I have witnessed fuel flow coming to a stop if a long fuel hose gets within about 1/2 inch of the fuel level in the tank. In other words you may have to reroute your hose if it rises before it drops again to the nipple on the carb. Hope this helps. We admire your perseverance in this matter. ps. clean the threads on the petcock screws and lube them with grease or anti seize.

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Thanks. As I was draining it, it had occurred to me to loosen the gas cap.  I didn't see a whole lot of change in the flow.  I don't know on the Ethanol.  Our gas is imported from the US, but I don't know if we get the ethanol additive.  My fuel hose is routed in the grooves provided by the manufacturer.  I don't think it rises  before the carb.  I know it is not a steep slope.  Years ago I was chasing a fuel problem and put an inline filter in that hose which was a mistake.  The engine wouldn't run so I took it out. Thanks for the tip on the petcock screws. I'll definitely use some anti-seize!  Thanks again and I hope to be able to reassemble the whole thing tmro and try it out!!  (Living down here for nearly 20 years, I have had to learn perseverance along with creativity to adapt.)

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, Belizeted said:

Thanks. As I was draining it, it had occurred to me to loosen the gas cap.  I didn't see a whole lot of change in the flow.  I don't know on the Ethanol.  Our gas is imported from the US, but I don't know if we get the ethanol additive.  My fuel hose is routed in the grooves provided by the manufacturer.  I don't think it rises  before the carb.  I know it is not a steep slope.  Years ago I was chasing a fuel problem and put an inline filter in that hose which was a mistake.  The engine wouldn't run so I took it out. Thanks for the tip on the petcock screws. I'll definitely use some anti-seize!  Thanks again and I hope to be able to reassemble the whole thing tmro and try it out!!  (Living down here for nearly 20 years, I have had to learn perseverance along with creativity to adapt.)

We are here to help you. Thank you for expressing appreciation . ps. it is a good idea to let it drain with the fuel cap on for a minute or two. This procedure will determine if the vent is working properly.

 

Edited by Misterclean
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20 hours ago, Belizeted said:

 (Living down here for nearly 20 years, I have had to learn perseverance along with creativity to adapt.)

 

 

So tell us about Belize.   Looks like an interesting country.  Guatamala, Mexico, and the Caribbean borders it.  Small but rapidly growing population.

 

You've been there 20 years.  Where were you before the move there?

 

I think here in the US we are spoiled when it comes to sourcing ATV parts.  I know we have guys here from the UK who pay through the nose for parts.  They're somewhat higher in Canada.  Super high in Australia.  I'm guessing the ATV parts market in Belize probably isn't cheap either?

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I have been to Belize , dove in the Blue Hole and went into the jungle to explore the Mayan ruins , that was about 30 years ago now , beautiful place , we stood in a beach house right on the beach , it was super inexpensive back then , the dollar exchange was very low , we had a cleaning lady and a chef who cooked for us every day ,  he even cooked the fish we caught on charters , and fishing was great , they warned us about robbers when  going into the jungle , when I was in my teens , Belize was called British Honduras ----- all the people we dealt with were super  nice , friendly and helpful , nothing like the Hawaii people , who really did sucked --- I have been to many dive / vacation destinations around the world and there is  only spot I would say that is nicer then Belize and that is St Thomas / St Croix and St John  Virgin Isle

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Thanks.  Belize has sure changed.  No inexpensive places on the beach anymore.  When we came in 2003, it was the near the end of the quiet, inexpensive Belize.  I'm in a remote fishing village which is remote no longer with a major road coming in during the next few years with lots of development.  We came from rural Alaska.  Fortunately, I snagged a nice remote piece of land which we've been developing over the years and plan to live full time.  The ATV is needed because we have no road access there - which is how we like it!  

 

To be honest, I wouldn't move here to Belize if I was to do it now, but we are pretty set-up and where else can you go that is quiet and peaceful and where people don't try to hustle you?

 

The latest on the ATV project is that I got the carb cleaned, the gas tank cleaned, and filled it up to test it and gas was leaking like ! out of the petcock hole.  It seems the JB weld didn't hold the nut so the o-ring didn't seat correctly.  What I did was weld the nut into the plastic tank using a soldering iron and a plastic zip tie for material which I saw on a YouTube thing.  It seems to hold the nut pretty well, but I'm not putting any real torque on it.  I applied some Permatex on the sealing surfaces and am waiting right now for it to dry!

 

Wish me luck. 

 

PS - Yes the ATV parts are outrageous here as is any small engine parts.  I usually buy the stuff online and bring it in by USPS mail.  I still have to pay high shipping and customs fees.  The cost of living in paradise. 

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Thanks.  I seem to remember that stuff from my sailboating days.  If my thing doesn't work, I'll try it out.  I'd have to make another long trip to Belize City.  The nautical shops probably have it!

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