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Turbo Twister

New to me 2002 TRX450 S

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If you change the oil most oil filters will come with the larger o ring that goes on the cover.  There's a smaller oring up where the cap juts out that might be missing as well.  That one doesn't come with new filters.

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We received new front drive shafts two days ago from Niche Industries. I fitted them yesterday, refitted the knuckles and replaced the outer track rod ends. Today I had a look at the hubs and specifically the High Lifter wheel bolt and disc carriers which are supposed to be a press fit into the hubs. My problem is that the splines do not match. I drove one bolt in about 1.5 mm but could not get it in any further. I took it out again and measured across the splines on the bolt. The measurement on the old bolt is 10.48mm and that of the new is 10.86 mm. What should I do to make the bolts fit? It would be relatively easy to reduce the diameter of the splined part of the bolt but if I do this and subsequently need to change the hubs I could be faced with the problem of bolts being loose in the new hubs.

 

Has anyone else had this problem and if so how did they fix it?  Picture of old and new bolts attached.

Old v new wheel bolts.jpg

Edited by Bluezulu49
Fat finger spelling error correction.
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14 minutes ago, Bluezulu49 said:

We received new front drive shafts two days ago from Niche Industries. I fitted them yesterday, refitted the knuckles and replaced the outer track rod ends. Today I had a look at the hubs and specifically the High Lifter wheel bolt and disc carriers which are supposed to be a press fit into the hubs. My problem is that the splines do not match. I drove one bolt in about 1.5 mm but could not get it in any further. I took it out again and measured across the splines on the bolt. The measurement on the old bolt is 10.48mm and that of the new is 10.86 mm. What should I do to make the bolts fit? It would be relatively easy to reduce the diameter of the splined part of the bolt but if I do this and subsequently need to change the hubs I could be faced with the problem of bolts being loose in the new hubs.

 

Has anyone else had this problem and if so how did they fix it?  Picture of old and new bolts attached.

Old v new wheel bolts.jpg

 @shadetree  is the Highlifter specialist  ---  I'm a SuperATV guy 

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Just to be sure I measured all of the new bolts and they were pretty uniform at 10.85mm so the one I tried to install is not an outlier. In the meantime I will try freezing them to see how much they contract.

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So Turbo came home this evening and we decided to attack the hubs. He produced a 10.5mm hss drill bit and we bored out the holes in the hubs. We pressed the new wheel studs partly in using a vice and then drove them home by resting a lump hammer on the inside of the stud and hitting it with another lump hammer. This drove all of the studs hopme and so the rebuild can continue.

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Update on the bike! Dad has been quite busy with the brakes on the 450 and what a job he's doing. He has the brake pads and discs on now and the wheels are fitting as they should. He attempted to bleed the brakes today but unfortunately cannot seem to get any pressure build up, so we will have to troubleshoot that issue.

 

I have lots of work to do on the plastics and mud guards in the coming weeks, as most of the clips that bolt it all together are damaged or missing completely. I finish work in a week so will have a bit more time to work on it🤞

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I am not a  Highlifter  conversion kit guy , I only have SuperATV ,  something don't look right in this pic , see where the hub mates with the ring , big gap on the bottom and nothing on top 

image.png

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I'm no expert on ether atv type disk converssion ....... But i see what fish is talking about.... So that part pressed on because there are no splines on the bolt shank in that gap space.... 

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6 hours ago, _Wilson_™ said:

I'm no expert on ether atv type disk converssion ....... But i see what fish is talking about.... So that part pressed on because there are no splines on the bolt shank in that gap space.... 

I think what happens with that type of hub is.  The bolts act as the wheel studs. They thread into that ring. Seems like either they were not tightened or not tightened evenly.  
 

That has nothing to do with why it is giving a hard time bleeding.  Are the bleeder screws to the top.  The calipers could be installed upside down 

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14 hours ago, Fishfiles said:

I am not a  Highlifter  conversion kit guy , I only have SuperATV ,  something don't look right in this pic , see where the hub mates with the ring , big gap on the bottom and nothing on top 

image.png

Hi Fish. The outer ring in the picture is a spacer which comes with the brake kit. It sits on the wheel studs and is bolted tight to the hub when the wheel is bolted on. They are both currently held in place on the wheel studs by one bolt only to keep them out of the way. The original wheel nuts are in very poor condition and I am waiting for replacements which should have been here yesterday. The spacer ring is not threaded and is a fairly loose fit on the wheel studs.  This is still very much a work in progress.

More worrying is the fact that I cannot build pressure in the braking system. The manual I have says to bleed the furthest wheel, ( the left hand one when sitting on the quad), first and while I have got a stream of brake fluid coming out with no bubbles on both callipers, there is no pressure on the brake lever and the brake pads have not moved up to the discs. I had a look at some youtube videos and have followed the suggestion that I put a spring clamp on the brake lever to hold it in the pulled position for some time, 24 to 48 hours, to see if that improves things. If it does not I will disconnect the brake pipe from the master cylinder and see if the lever is generating any fluid pressure using my finger as a gauge. There are no fluid leaks that I can see from the brake lines. The fluid on the floor under the bike spilled when we disconnected the drum brakes.


It appears from talking to Turbo that the front brakes failed pretty well as soon as he unloaded the quad from his van when he purchased it. The master cylinder and lever both appear to be new and are I suspect from China.

 

Photos attached showing the spacer pushed up against the hub and the master cylinder.

Spacer.jpg

spacer2.jpg

Master cylinder top.jpg

Master cylinder front.jpg

Edited by Bluezulu49
Clarification re brake fluid spill.

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I remember what them Highlifter studs look like now ,  the spacer is made into the stud ,  totally different than the Super ATV , mine do thread into the ring and are nothing more than a long bolt with threads all the way and a slip on spacer to achieve the distance ---  did you contact Highlifter to see if they will sell you studs ?  Highlifter is here in my home state Louisiana , USA

 

 

Instead of removing the banjo fitting and using your finger to check for pressure and take a chance  of introducing more air into the system , pinch the hose and pump against it , it will tell you quick if you mater is good or not  ----- as far as bleeding the farthest away caliper , which caliper is farther from the master , that really doesn't make a difference on the 450 , there is a tee in the middle and one a-arm night be 1 inch longer than the other , try this procedure :

 

You need two pinch pliers to do this procedure , if you don't have them , then  small vise grips will work , if you are using vise grips use a piece of rubber or cardboard to make a u-shaped hose protector so the teeth don't damage the hose ,first pinch the hose right out of the master , if the master is good it will make the lever hard with one maybe two pumps ( first time )  at the most , if it test good  then leave the pliers there , attach another pair pf pliers on one side of the tee , blocking off one side , so that you are only working with one side at a time ----  here is the technique , pump the lever till you feel pressure then with your other hand release the pliers, when the pressure on the  lever releases and the lever touches the handle bar , re-pinch the pliers before letting the lever go , then pump the lever till pressure is achieved and repeat the previous procedure , so what you are doing is force feeding pressure thru the hose , a pump at a time , then it helps to have another person to start bleeding the bleeder valve , when you feel you have pressure to one side , then move the pinch pliers to the other side of the tee and repeat on that side 

 

 

 

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27 minutes ago, Fishfiles said:

 did you contact Highlifter to see if they will sell you studs ? 

The studs as supplied from Highlifter seem to be ok. The original wheel nuts are in a bad way and I have already sourced new ones. 

Many thanks for the info re checking the pressure by clamping the hoses. Brain not working too well today as we have had our first snow of the winter and the temperature is just above freezing at
2.7 C, 37F, a big change from earlier in the week when it was above 10C, 50F even at night.

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19 minutes ago, Bluezulu49 said:

 Brain not working too well today as we have had our first snow of the winter and the temperature is just above freezing at
2.7 C, 37F, a big change from earlier in the week when it was above 10C, 50F even at night.

 

 

I seen snow on TV before  >>>  can't imagine >>>  round here all I know about ice is that a SnowBall is shaved ice made by a machine with  flavoring , I like grape myself 

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On 12/8/2022 at 2:31 PM, Turbo Twister said:

Update on the bike! Dad has been quite busy with the brakes on the 450 and what a job he's doing. He has the brake pads and discs on now and the wheels are fitting as they should. He attempted to bleed the brakes today but unfortunately cannot seem to get any pressure build up, so we will have to troubleshoot that issue.

 

I have lots of work to do on the plastics and mud guards in the coming weeks, as most of the clips that bolt it all together are damaged or missing completely. I finish work in a week so will have a bit more time to work on it🤞

20221208_201752.jpg

20221208_201800.jpg

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20221208_201818.jpg

flip the outer disk around, you have it on backwards.

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We did a further test on the brake lines following advice from @Fishfiles. We appear to have 2 leaks, but cannot confirm exactly where they are so we intend to replace the complete brake line with new hose and fittings which dad has ordered. We suspect the leaks may be coming from the metal fittings that bolt onto the back of the hubs on either side, as one of them was slightly oily from the day before. As we were trying to bleed the pipes on both sides, there were plenty of bubbles coming out and no pressure would build up.

 

We hope this is the last issue for the time being as I really need to get the bike to work on the farm

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1 hour ago, Turbo Twister said:

We did a further test on the brake lines following advice from @Fishfiles. We appear to have 2 leaks, but cannot confirm exactly where they are so we intend to replace the complete brake line with new hose and fittings which dad has ordered. We suspect the leaks may be coming from the metal fittings that bolt onto the back of the hubs on either side, as one of them was slightly oily from the day before. As we were trying to bleed the pipes on both sides, there were plenty of bubbles coming out and no pressure would build up.

 

We hope this is the last issue for the time being as I really need to get the bike to work on the farm

bad sealing washers is where most leak.

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**Update**

 

The bike is finally put back together again and while it took a lot of effort to get the front end back together, I figured out that at some point the bike got a hard knock on the right hand side. The front bumper RHS is much closer to the front of the wheel than the LHS, and none of the clips or holes for plastic mounting points line up. But that's ok, I can live with that.

 

The only issue I do have is the front lights. All 3 were working before we stripped it back, but now only the handlebar spot lights works. Dad checked the loom from the back of the lights into the next connection and neither have any power running to them. Anything I should be looking out for? I can manage with 1 light currently as I don't tend to drive either bike in the dark, but it will need looked at at some point. 

20230111_220112.jpg

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31 minutes ago, Turbo Twister said:

I figured out that at some point the bike got a hard knock on the right hand side. The front bumper RHS is much closer to the front of the wheel than the LHS, and none of the clips or holes for plastic mounting points line up. But that's ok, I can live with that.

 

Does the frame look bent any place ? 

 

Good to see y'all back ! 

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Not sure where the three wire plug goes back into the main harness, but I figure the pod light is on the same fuse as the lower lights.  That said, I'd start at the fuse, and work my way forward until you find a break. 

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15 hours ago, _Wilson_™ said:

 

Does the frame look bent any place ? 

 

Good to see y'all back ! 

I haven't really had a good look at it yet, I brought it back home this evening and plan to check out the main frame with my laser level over the coming days to check for any discrepancies in shape. The front bumper frame and racks do have noticeable bends from a front impact, so I would think the frame got a bit of a knock too somewhere. I'll revert and update when I have checked, life is hectic at the moment!

 

Happy New Year to you all.

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8 hours ago, jeepwm69 said:

Not sure where the three wire plug goes back into the main harness, but I figure the pod light is on the same fuse as the lower lights.  That said, I'd start at the fuse, and work my way forward until you find a break. 

I read somewhere that a fella described the wiring harness on a 450 like a tributary of rivers, you just have to keep going up stream until you find the problem. I didn't take any notice of the harness when the front plastics were off as I didn't know of any problems, but I'll look at it when I'm at it again.

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1 hour ago, Turbo Twister said:

I haven't really had a good look at it yet, I brought it back home this evening and plan to check out the main frame with my laser level over the coming days to check for any discrepancies in shape. The front bumper frame and racks do have noticeable bends from a front impact, so I would think the frame got a bit of a knock too somewhere. I'll revert and update when I have checked, life is hectic at the moment!

 

Happy New Year to you all.

 

Well it was a few ago..... But thank you! Happy New Years to y'all as well!.... When you mentioned the plastics wouldn't line up... I figure not only might it be the bumper... Tuned in for what y'all find out. 

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I have been unwell for a while but have now recovered and have come back to give some closure to the brake saga in the hope of helping someone else.


We fitted 2 new brake lines from the master cylinder to the slaves and used new banjo bolts and washers. These items were sourced from CMSNL in Holland. We carried out a gravity bleed by just opening one nipple at a time and allowing brake fluid to dribble out into a container until there were no more bubbles. Then we shut off the nipple and carried out a conventional bleed. We then repeated this on the other side. One complication was that the bleed nipples appeared to be imperial rather than metric so we had to use an old magneto spanner to open and shut the nipples.

 

This procedure worked first time and the disc brakes appear to be working fine. I examined the old washers and banjo bolts and they appear to be fine with no signs of pitting.

 

My conclusion is that the lower brake line which tees into the one from the master cylinder was perished and was expanding rather than passing on hydraulic pressure to the wheel calipers.

 

Thanks again for all your help guys.

 

Bluezulu49.

 

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