winchester

I am getting 12v on both of those when I turn the key on.

I took the valve body assembly off and soaked it in my ultrasonic cleaner and cleaned it out but I'm still getting the code 15. It looks like I'm only getting around 1.5 volts at the yellow/black wire at the shift solenoid when I attempt to shift and then it goes down to 1.1 volts. From what I've read online it is supposed to be getting around 5v-6v I think. Anyone know what could be causing that? It has thrown that code with 2 different pcms so I don't think that is the problem. I ran through all the checks in the fsm but there's no instructions on what to do if the voltage is low.

The code 23 when using the emergency shift tool turned out to be normal according to the fsm. The solid "-" problem came back and also the gearshift indicator started flashing a code 24 on the gearshift indicator after messing with it a bit. I thoroughly checked the wiring and connectors between the electric shift motor and the pcm and couldn't find anything wrong. I ended up buying a new electric shift motor which still didn't fix the problem, then I saw pic related post while searching through other forums where a guy was saying the pcm and shift motor should be replaced as an assembly if the 30 amp fuse is blown. When I first received the bike and it was constantly flashing "-" someone had put a piece of metal in place of the 30 amp fuse so I assume it had or was blowing with them. I ended up getting another used pcm which fixed the problem. I will make sure not to use the new pcm with the original shift motor in the future. Now I am back to just getting the code 15 when I press the shift buttons. I checked out the shift solenoid wiring continuity and connectors and it seems fine. I checked the resistance and it is within specs of the fsm. I took off the shift solenoid and blew through it while I jumped it to a 12 volt battery. When it gets 12 volts I cant blow through it and when I unhook the battery I can so I think it is working correctly. I won't be leaving the house in the next couple weeks due to the coronavirus so I am planning to take the valve body off when the rain stops and see if there is any trash in it.

I noticed when I put 12v to the shift motor that it vibrates as it turns does anyone know if that's normal? I read that it only gets around 6v when it's on the bike so I'm gonna try to find a 6v battery to put to it and see if it still turns

Was messing with it a bit more today and ran through the electrical tests melatv posted. I think the 33 pin grey connector wasn't making a good contact, I cleaned it out and plugged it back in and it seems to have taken care of the solid "-" problem. Now the gearshift indicator seems to display "N" correctly when it is in neutral. If I shift it through the gears using the emergency shifter tool it displays a code 23 most of the time, I think that is for the shift angle sensor. I left the electric shift motor connected to the wiring harness but took it off the engine to see if it would spin when I tried to shift it and it doesn't move. If I press the shift buttons while the gearshift indicator is displaying "N" then I can hear like a faint beep noise and then I get a code 15 on the gearshift indicator. If I press the buttons after it starts blinking the code 15 then nothing happens. I checked the continuity of the wires going from the electric shift motor to the pcm as per the factory service manual and it all checked out fine. Might mess with it some more tonight, if I do I will update the thread if I figure anything else out.

OK I had some time to mess with it this morning and I noticed that the "-" would disappear and the gear shift indicator would display an "N" after starting it and letting it run for a few seconds. I didn't run it that long before since I didn't have the exhaust on it and I didn't want to ! the neighbors off. If I just turn the key on it displays a solid "-" though. I took the electric shift motor off and put 12v to it and it does turn. I shifted the atv into first with the emergency shifter tool and it will move. When I try to shift it using the electric shift buttons it gives me a code 15 for the shift solenoid valve. I took the shift solenoid valve off and put 12v to it and it clicks and I think the pin inside it moves a bit. I did some googling and found pic related page about using the emergency valve but I followed the instructions and it still wouldn't shift using the shift buttons, maybe that is meant to be used along with the emergency shifter tool or if it wont even move in gear? I am starting to think the problem is going to be with the oil pump or maybe one of the oil passages clogged up, or the shift solenoid valve not working correctly. I will run through melatvs suggestions and check all the wiring and electronics again when I get a chance.

Yes the N light turns green and I can start the atv once it is in Neutral.

I finally got around to putting the motor put back in and got it running today. I can shift through all gears now using the emergency shifter tool, the gear indicator just displays a solid "-" that doesn't flash at all. The shift buttons don't seem to do anything. Anyone have any ideas? I think I will pull the shift motor out tonight and see if I can put power to it and get it to spin.

I got the motor put back together today. So it's normal to have to turn the motor over to shift through all the gears with the hand tool when it's not running? I noticed there's kind of a sweet spot where I can shift up and down through all of them sometimes with the hand tool but I normally have to turn the engine over with a ratchet while trying to shift with the hand tool to get through them all.

I was messing with the engine some more today and I noticed that it doesn't always like to go into every gear without spinning the shaft that the primary clutch goes onto (pic related). Is that normal? Looking from the top of the crankcase it appears that the gears inside don't always mesh up without spinning that shaft a bit. I guess if the engine was running and in gear that shaft would be spinning all the time so it wouldn't be an issue? It mostly doesn't like going from 3rd to 4th unless I kind of hold the shifter tool and spin that shaft a bit and then it goes in.

Still waiting on parts. Should I buy the stuff to hone the cylinder and replace the piston rings when I put this this thing back together or just send it? The engine only has like 2000 miles on it.

My cheap chinese calipers say the outside diameter is 1.380" and inside diameter is about .990". Not sure if it came from the front or rear covers, I noticed it on the bench after I got done taking both covers off. Looking at the manual it says that there should be a spacer behind the drive gear in the rear and it is about that size so I'm going to say that is where it came from, didn't see any specs for it though.

Yeah I was afraid of something like that happening, it's why I really didn't want to split the cases unless I had to. Those transmission schematics look kinda complicated. Also It was kind of a PITA to wiggle that motor out of the frame so I really don't want to have to do it twice. I smashed the speed sensor connector against the frame the first time and had to order a new one of those as well. Not looking forward to trying to fit it back in there. Does anyone know off the top of their head how much hondabond I'll need to put this thing back together? I ordered a couple 1.9fl oz tubes off of ebay but I'm not sure if that will be enough. I didn't split the cases so I just need it for the front and back covers I guess. Also if anyone knows off the top of their head where this washer/spacer thing goes it would be much appreciated.

Well the quad appears to shift fine now, I took the head off and shined a flash light into the crankcase at the shift drum and forks while I tried shifting it back and fourth and didn't really see anything wrong in there, then I took the gearshift linkage apart on the outside of the crankcase that the shift shaft slides on to and inspected the parts (looked fine) and put them back on and tried again and it shifts fine now. I guess one of the parts were binding before or someone took this thing apart before and put them back on wrong. Someone has been inside this thing before as I noticed a bunch of missing bolts (and one of the head bolts were missing) and the clutch nuts were kind of marred up. I just gotta get a gasket set now and spacer case with a new drain plug and put it all back together. I noticed a couple of shims/washers that fell out at some point when I was taking it apart so I'm hoping the factory service manual shows where they go when I put it back together.. lol

Yeah I don't think it is the problem either. Before I pulled the motor I looked up the code in the service manual and checked the continuity of the wiring to the ecu and to ground and it was fine and the solenoid resistance was within specs. Yes, most of the time. occasionally it binds at the 'top' and doesn't return unless I wiggle it a bit.

The quad fired right up and ran good with some fresh gas in it and the new ECU. The electric shift buttons didn't work, when I tried to shift into gear from neutral it would just go from N on the gear indicator to displaying a blinking "-" giving me a code 15 i think (one long blink and 5 short ones), the emergency shift tool wouldn't shift it into first either. I pulled the engine out and pulled the front and rear covers off and didn't notice anything obviously wrong with the shift shaft or mechanism behind the front cover. It will shift up into what I guess is first, second, and third gears sometimes if I try shifting it using fast, hard strokes. Sometimes it binds at the 'top' of the shift and I have to wiggle the shaft a bit for it to 'lock in'. When I can get it to shift up it will usually shift back down to neutral normally . Looking at the service manual I think the problem is going to be one of the shift forks being bent or broken inside the crankcase. I will have to clear up some space in the shop and get a big enough socket to take the clutches off before I can take it apart further.

It finally stopped raining long enough for me to swap the new ECU in and I now have spark and the fuel pump sounds like it's working. The gear indicator on the dash stopped blinking "-" as well and it now says it's in neutral. I did notice that it doesn't turn over now when I press the electric start button, might have something to do with the $10 chinese starter solenoid I bought. I will drain out all the old gas and put some fresh in it and top the oil off once I get a chance and see if I can get it running.

Thanks for this. I actually read that thread when I was researching how to fix the drain plug, didn't realize you were the same person. If I don't have to split the cases and take the head off I will probably just try to replace the case section with the drain plug depending on if this motor looks fixable when I take it out, I found the section with the drain plug on ebay for like $60.00. I have a new(used) pcm coming in today so I'm hoping that takes care of my no spark/no fuel pump issue.

Yes I actually put a brand new oem engine stop relay/fuel pump relay on it. I may have a go at replacing the case once I get it out and apart, I mainly wanted to try to mess with as little stuff as possible while I'm in there as I haven't taken an engine apart before and I was afraid I'd end up spending a bunch of money on parts and gaskets and put it back together wrong somehow. I'm mainly trying to fix it for fun and to learn anyway though and there are some decent videos on youtube of a guy rebuilding the bottom end of one of these.

I am sure there is something in there that is damaged either with the clutch or shift shaft or something. I would prefer to convert it to a foot shift rather than keep the ES and automatic shifting to be honest depending on how much is involved, I already did a bit of research into that but most of the threads that came up using google were for the older honda 350 ES models. I would like to get the wiring sorted first before I pull the motor and check it out, that way if I decide to try to fix this one or find a good used motor and put it in and it doesn't run I know the problem is with the engine and not the electronics. I know some places that sell used and rebuilt motors give you a short time to return it and I'd hate to waste that trying to figure out the wiring. I already spent a couple weekends going through the factory service manual troubleshooting and waiting on parts. I'm running out of things to test at this point other than buying another pcm to try.

Thanks. Yeah it's late here as well, I figured I wouldn't get any responses until tomorrow I just wanted to go ahead and post it before I forgot anything since I was messing with it earlier.

Long backstory: I bought a 2013 Honda Rancher 420 for $500 about a year and a half ago for a project. It may be a bit of a basket case but my dad does ATV salvage on the side so I figured if I couldn't get it running I could at least get my money back out of it pretty easily. When I first got it it was stuck in gear and I couldn't get it back in neutral even with the emergency shifter tool. I didn't have an atv at the time and needed one running pretty quick to use for hunting so I took it to a local guy who works on atvs. He kept it for like 6-7 months and then said that it would be cheaper to just get a new motor to put in it than to pay him to fix that one (he didn't specifically say what was wrong with mine though other than it needs a new bottom end and it might need a new wiring harness or pcm). He showed me a video of where he had it running at one point. I told him I'd probably just end up parting it out and got it back from him. I recently started messing with this Rancher again and going through the factory service manual testing procedure for no spark I noticed that the ignition coil, engine stop relay, starter solenoid, and bank angle sensor were now missing so I replaced them with used oem parts from ebay. The mechanic at least got it in neutral so it should start and run if I can get the electronics sorted. I got a cheap Grizzly 700 and got it running while he had the Rancher so I'm not in any desperate need of this one but It's a nice quad so I'd like to 'rescue it' and fix it for the learning experience and to use as a backup if possible. quick rundown of symptoms: Quad has no spark. neutral light is lit up on the dash but it may or may not get stuck in gear if i shift it out of neutral The gear indicator is continuously blinking "-" on the dash. There are no DTCs (flashing check engine light). I have gone through and tested all the wiring and harnesses as per the factory service manual except for these two things: 1.) replacing pcm with a known good one and 2.)testing peak voltage of the ckp sensor. (I have a dva multimeter adapter but I'm not sure exactly how to use it to be honest with you). the voltage at the ignition coil is the battery voltage (between 12 and 13 volts) when I turn the key on and it drops to 9v-10v while cranking I read the other thread on here and tried connecting a jumper wire from the BL/R wire on the ignition coil to the positive post on the battery. Nothing changed except I noticed when I turn the key off the display doesn't go off until I disconnect that wire. I noticed there was no sound coming from the fuel pump when i turn the key on so I unplugged the connector and tested the voltage at the fuel pump connector when I turn the key on and there was none bonus: also someone stripped out the drain plug at some point and it appears that they drilled it out and put a rubber boat plug in it and it leaks oil pretty good so if anyone has any ideas on how to fix that without splitting the cases and replacing the drain plug half I'm all ears. I was thinking about getting like a 16mx1.5 oversized drain plug and tapping the case for that and screwing the plug in finger tight and jb welding it in place and just using a pump to pump the oil out from the top in the future.