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Bossdaddy

2004 Honda Foreman 450 ES, shifting problems

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Well here is another one but this one is different from the 2001. This one shifts gears from neutral to reverse back to neutral then to 1st no problem, here is where the problem starts, push the button to go to 2nd, 3rd and so on it sounds like it is shifting but push the down button and on the first shift down it's back in neutral. After all the up shifting it never leaves 1st gear, it does the same thing with the manual shifter. It sounds like it is shifting but it never leaves 1st. I've tried shifting while moving and sitting still same results.

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My guess would be a problem with number 6 in this print , the bolt backed out or sheered off or the spring broke 

image.png

  

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4 hours ago, Bossdaddy said:

Well here is another one but this one is different from the 2001. This one shifts gears from neutral to reverse back to neutral then to 1st no problem, here is where the problem starts, push the button to go to 2nd, 3rd and so on it sounds like it is shifting but push the down button and on the first shift down it's back in neutral. After all the up shifting it never leaves 1st gear, it does the same thing with the manual shifter. It sounds like it is shifting but it never leaves 1st. I've tried shifting while moving and sitting still same results.

when you run across something like this ?, the only true way to find out what the problem is, IS TEARING INTO IT !. you must know how these machines operate, until then ?, you are just tossing money and time into the wind. if it won't shift with the manual shift shaft , then this is a shift drum issue ?, shifting shaft issue ?, or gear dog issue ?. take the electric parts all the way out of this picture, now try to narrow down as to why it wont shift through all the gears.

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Fishfiles, that picture scares the crap out of me, I don't even know where that stuff is located. Shadetree, I agree I got to dig into this thing, thank god I don't think it's electrical. Thanks to both of you guys for your comment.

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59 minutes ago, Bossdaddy said:

Fishfiles, that picture scares the crap out of me, I don't even know where that stuff is located. Shadetree, I agree I got to dig into this thing, thank god I don't think it's electrical. Thanks to both of you guys for your comment.

at the front of the motor, where the shift motor is, where the angle sensor is, there is a cover there, it has about 4-5 bolts holding it to the front cover. under this cover is your electric shifting transfer gears, as well as most of the parts fish posted ^^. you need to look in the service manual for this machine, it will show you where everything is located, and give you an idea how everything operates.

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18 , 19 and 20 can also be stripped out causing a shift problem 

 

image.png

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I've seen 18, 19 and 20 before I wish that was the problem but I bet it's not, that would be to easy, thanks.

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It looks very intimidating, but once you get in there it's not as bad as you'd think. 

 

I agree with Shade that if it won't shift right with the emergency shifter, you have a problem with the shift drum or linkage.

 

Best bet is to take the fan out (give you room to work), stand it up on the back rack, and then unbolt and remove the front engine cover.  Not much to that, and you can look and see if anything is apparent without having to take anything apart.

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Thanks for the advice. If I stand it up do I need to drain the oil before I stand it up?

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The 1st step, since the issue is a mechanical one is to remove the front cover as the guys have mentioned. You'll need to determine whether the issue is with the shifting linkage/ratchet mechanism parts on the end of the shift drum, or with the shift drum itself. Often times when the transmission fails to shift manually the bolt in the center of the shift drum is found to have loosened up.

 

gearshift-linkage.png

 

gearshift-linkage1.png

 

As Jeepwm69 mentioned you can stand the Foreman up to make the work easier on your back and hands, or you can drain the motor oil and remove the cover as it sits. The work is generally not difficult, but finding easy access to everything and keeping dirt out of your work can become a challenge... I recommend that you begin with a thorough pressure wash of the bike.

 

frt-cover-removal.png

 

In order to remove the front driveshaft you'll need to remove the bolts and bracket holding the front differential onto the frame and then slide the diff all of the way forward in the frame as far as it will go. Then pull the driveshaft off of the motor (the coupler is spring loaded) and set it aside.

 

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2 minutes ago, Bossdaddy said:

Thanks for the advice. If I stand it up do I need to drain the oil before I stand it up?

no, but jeep forgot to tell you, you have to unbolt the front diff, pull it forward, , remove the drive shaft, then you can stand it up on its tail, and remove the front cover., or at least start with the transfer gear area, see if anything is messed up there ?, if not ?, then its time to pull front cover.

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Maybe that pic will be less intimidating if I mentioned  that #31 and #30  are for  the ES shift shaft model and  #18 and #10 are for  the foot shift shaft FM model , all the other parts in the pic are common to both 

image.png

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1 hour ago, shadetree said:

no, but jeep forgot to tell you, you have to unbolt the front diff, pull it forward, , remove the drive shaft, then you can stand it up on its tail, and remove the front cover., or at least start with the transfer gear area, see if anything is messed up there ?, if not ?, then its time to pull front cover.

 

I did forget that!  On the 500's the cover goes around the driveshaft so you don't have to remove it.

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Hey guys, I'm back. As some of you that followed the 2001 shift problems, I bought a 2000 Foreman to sort of use as needed. I finally got finished with it and one of the grandsons has taken over it so I'm going to try and start on the 2004. I'll need help!

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I've got the diff loose and slid forward, driveshaft is loose. Oil drained, filter out and oil lines pulled back. Does the driveshaft come apart for more room when removing the cover. Is there anything else that comes off (13 bolts) or needs to be loosened before cover removal.?

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1 hour ago, Bossdaddy said:

I've got the diff loose and slid forward, driveshaft is loose. Oil drained, filter out and oil lines pulled back. Does the driveshaft come apart for more room when removing the cover. Is there anything else that comes off (13 bolts) or needs to be loosened before cover removal.?

boss, if your differential is loose and pulled forward as far as you can the driveshaft should compress back just enough to pull it off the engine.  

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It's loose from the engine and you told me it should stay out of the way for the cover to come off.

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Mistook what you wanted, the driveshaft will be able to be bent out of the way enough to remove the cover.  You should remove the shift motor and conectors also...

 

The service manual has a pretty good explanation for steps to remove the front cover....

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Yes that's all off just checking if anything else is going to get me. Don't know what to expect when cover starts coming off. Anything going to fall off or what comes off with it is supposed to come off with it. I saw a adjustment screw on the cover what about that?

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That's the clutch adjustment screw, its attached.  I see this is a 2004 model, mine is a 1998 so not sure if there are any differences.  I don't believe I had anything fall off but its been a couple years....

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Yea you got some special help there...

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12 minutes ago, Bossdaddy said:

Retro and Melatv spoiled me bad, spoon feeding me on the 2001 we did.

If it didn't say ES after the 450 you could get more help -------   shoot ,  you wouldn't be needing help ---- I'd bet the engine is going to come out before it is over 

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5 minutes ago, Fishfiles said:

If it didn't say ES after the 450 you could get more help -------   shoot ,  you wouldn't be needing help ---- I'd bet the engine is going to come out before it is over 

Party pooper....lol

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