_Wilson_™ 6,567 Posted August 5, 2020 @_Wilson_™why do you keep the seals off? you got me there..... mine are still on, lol! both the 97, and 2000 300 fwd's my old boss at Johnny's cycles (Johnny) said for those who ride in deep water, and muck..... usually don't do what's needed to maintain .... the grease between the drum seal, and backing plate.... and vent lines.... so moisture... (as fish stated) gets in, and over time corrosion sets in, and, without the seals ... the moisture / water can drain / evaporate... and to deal with what muck gets in .... just pull the adjusting plug (rubber plug) and wash the muck out.... the lack of the drum seal allows the mess to drain out, and the inside to dry...... now this would be for those who continuously ride in deep water.(which i don't) .. at least 1/3 of the way high on the front tires... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 5, 2020 15 minutes ago, _Wilson_™ said: you got me there..... mine are still on, lol! both the 97, and 2000 300 fwd's my old boss at Johnny's cycles (Johnny) said for those who ride in deep water, and muck..... usually don't do what's needed to maintain .... the grease between the drum seal, and backing plate.... and vent lines.... so moisture... (as fish stated) gets in, and over time corrosion sets in, and, without the seals ... the moisture / water can drain / evaporate... and to deal with what muck gets in .... just pull the adjusting plug (rubber plug) and wash the muck out.... the lack of the drum seal allows the mess to drain out, and the inside to dry...... now this would be for those who continuously ride in deep water.(which i don't) .. at least 1/3 of the way high on the front tires... Ahh okay I get you... Makes sense as I doubt people riding in deep mud/water care much about the brakes anyway lol. However, I'll be using this to pull small logs out the woods and pulling a small trailer round for livestock and fencing... so brakes would be handy lol. Don't wanna end up in the ditch after the trailer pushes me down a hill lol. Thanks buddy 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 5, 2020 Seal came off easier than I thought lol 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 7, 2020 Update: Just took out one of the intake valves from the head and cleaned it up, haven't lapped it yet... and to be honest it doesn't look the best. There is quite a bit of pitting around the edge. Not sure if it would improve a little after being lapped? Would be great to here your thoughts. Thanks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted August 7, 2020 I'd say that looks bad ---- How's about a pic of the head and a pic the valve stem it's self , looks like a lot of wear on it 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
_Wilson_™ 6,567 Posted August 7, 2020 from the pic it looks to be just one 1/2 side is pitted ... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 7, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Fishfiles said: I'd say that looks bad ---- How's about a pic of the head and a pic the valve stem it's self , looks like a lot of wear on it Yeah I thought it looked bad as well... Here's some more pics (pics of the head are after I've lapped it) Edited August 7, 2020 by TrxPipUK Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 7, 2020 1 hour ago, _Wilson_™ said: from the pic it looks to be just one 1/2 side is pitted ... One part is definitely a lot worse than the other parts. It's got pitting all the around, just some bits worse than others.... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shadetree 5,868 Posted August 7, 2020 you wont be able to save those valves, pitted way to bad. by the time you get them lapped down to a sealing surface ?, there wont be any metal left to hold up to it running. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 7, 2020 2 hours ago, shadetree said: you wont be able to save those valves, pitted way to bad. by the time you get them lapped down to a sealing surface ?, there wont be any metal left to hold up to it running. Okay new valves it is then 😞 . Any recommendations on what brand to go with? I saw some shindy ones (all 4 valves) on eBay, however I'm not sure if they ship to the UK yet (they're on the other side of the pond) Thanks for the help and knowledge 🙂 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted August 7, 2020 Pip , you mentioned that pic up above of your head with a valve out the hole is after you lapped the valve ( pic below ) , that doesn't look too good to me , I wouldn't roll with it ----- also something to look at , is how much play do you have between the valve guide and the valve stem 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shadetree 5,868 Posted August 8, 2020 10 hours ago, TrxPipUK said: Okay new valves it is then 😞 . Any recommendations on what brand to go with? I saw some shindy ones (all 4 valves) on eBay, however I'm not sure if they ship to the UK yet (they're on the other side of the pond) Thanks for the help and knowledge 🙂 shindy makes some great valves, if you can get them shipped to you ?, get all 4 of them !. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 8, 2020 (edited) 13 hours ago, Fishfiles said: Pip , you mentioned that pic up above of your head with a valve out the hole is after you lapped the valve ( pic below ) , that doesn't look too good to me , I wouldn't roll with it ----- also something to look at , is how much play do you have between the valve guide and the valve stem Yes I lapped it a little but not much at all, was just to get the muck of really and have a look. Also thought it would be silly to lap it with that old pitted out valve... The head should clean up after a good lapping though right? How would I check the amount of play between the valve stem and guide? Just see if I can feel sideways movement? Edited August 8, 2020 by TrxPipUK Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 8, 2020 5 hours ago, shadetree said: shindy makes some great valves, if you can get them shipped to you ?, get all 4 of them !. The ex valves that I've got look LOADS better than the in ones. But replacing all 4 is probably best right? Especially since 4 new shindy valves from the states are only £10 more than two new Honda in valves are. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted August 8, 2020 TRXPIPUK , How would I check the amount of play between the valve stem and guide? Just see if I can feel sideways movement? stick the valve thru the guide till about 1/4 from all the way seated against the head , grab the valve and try to move it side to side , should have no slop 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 8, 2020 29 minutes ago, Fishfiles said: TRXPIPUK , How would I check the amount of play between the valve stem and guide? Just see if I can feel sideways movement? stick the valve thru the guide till about 1/4 from all the way seated against the head , grab the valve and try to move it side to side , should have no slop Righto, thanks. I'll check that when I'm home after the weekend:) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
400exdad 16 Posted August 9, 2020 I’m using Kibblewhite valves now and they are working great. Springs are a bit stiffer. I did seals, springs, valves and retainers all at once. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 9, 2020 3 hours ago, 400exdad said: I’m using Kibblewhite valves now and they are working great. Springs are a bit stiffer. I did seals, springs, valves and retainers all at once. Well I've just ordered a set of shindy valves. Be awhile till they get here but still got other bits to be on with. How hard is it to do seals and retainers? Are the retainers the valve guides? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fishfiles 20,145 Posted August 9, 2020 I would call the retainer , the lock wedges on the valve stem spring cap , to get them off is easy , a hammer and a deep dish socket , putting them back on requires a spring clamp , you need to remove them retainers to get at the valve seals , which are a matter of just pushing them on 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 9, 2020 9 hours ago, Fishfiles said: I would call the retainer , the lock wedges on the valve stem spring cap , to get them off is easy , a hammer and a deep dish socket , putting them back on requires a spring clamp , you need to remove them retainers to get at the valve seals , which are a matter of just pushing them on Ahhh right yes I know what they are. Yes I've removed and installed them plenty before. Why would they need to be replaced?? Is replacing the the valve seals an easy job? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
400exdad 16 Posted August 10, 2020 When I did mine, I didn’t know what condition everything was in. I knew the valves needed to be done, and the seals needed to be replaced. Due to shipping times and not really wanting to be waiting longer for parts. So I just ordered everything. Valves, seals, guides, springs, keepers, the whole nine yards. I also didn’t know how the bike had been treated over the years since we bought it used. I ended up not needing the guides, but I have them for the future. Considering the cost to do it now, or take a chance of having to go back into it again, I opted to do it all at once. As it was, I screwed up and didn’t do the rings at the same time due to what I spent on the valves, and ended up back into it for those a couple of weeks later. Now that we have two of the same machines, if I need to do the second one, I already have some parts for it, and it is an 03 all original. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shadetree 5,868 Posted August 10, 2020 6 hours ago, TrxPipUK said: Ahhh right yes I know what they are. Yes I've removed and installed them plenty before. Why would they need to be replaced?? Is replacing the the valve seals an easy job? normally !..you do not need to replace the keepers ?, i do not. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 10, 2020 8 hours ago, 400exdad said: When I did mine, I didn’t know what condition everything was in. I knew the valves needed to be done, and the seals needed to be replaced. Due to shipping times and not really wanting to be waiting longer for parts. So I just ordered everything. Valves, seals, guides, springs, keepers, the whole nine yards. I also didn’t know how the bike had been treated over the years since we bought it used. I ended up not needing the guides, but I have them for the future. Considering the cost to do it now, or take a chance of having to go back into it again, I opted to do it all at once. As it was, I screwed up and didn’t do the rings at the same time due to what I spent on the valves, and ended up back into it for those a couple of weeks later. Now that we have two of the same machines, if I need to do the second one, I already have some parts for it, and it is an 03 all original. Ahh okay I get you. Makes sense Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 10, 2020 6 hours ago, shadetree said: normally !..you do not need to replace the keepers ?, i do not. Yeah I wasn't going to replace mine anyway lol... seems a waste of money unless they came with everything else lol 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrxPipUK 169 Posted August 16, 2020 Hi all. Wondering if anyone knows if these would would work for 350D front brake drums? Need something to plug up the holes and this is all I can find. Tia Share this post Link to post Share on other sites